23 replies to this topic

[Mack]

What is your suggestion?:

To add a few more missing mechanics to Hard Mode ToB to make it more engaging and deserving of being called Hard Mode. Currently, Hard Mode isn't much more difficult than Normal Mode and can be completed nearly as quickly in good teams so there's little reason to do Normal Mode.

 

Proposed Mechanics to be added:

 

Maiden:

The Maiden's attacks will deal more damage after three consecutive auto-attacks on a single target. If an individual tanks more than two times in a row, the next hits will deal double damage. Tank must rotate regularly. 

 

When any Nylocas Matomenos reach the Maiden, they will increase her Attack speed along with healing her, up to a cap of 5. (1 tick per Nylo that reaches) The Maiden's damage cap is also increased, meaning she can hit faster and harder than the regular version when Nylocas Matomenos reach her and players step on blood spots during the fight.

Basic attack damage ~= 36.5+3.5(crabs leaked)

 

Nylo Waves:

Add the three Nylocas Prinkipas that spawn during pre-challenge waves. Nylocas Prinkipas works similarly to normal mode Vasilias (Nylo Boss), swapping styles. These spawn in the center of the room on the tenth, twentieth, and thirtieth waves.

https://oldschool.ru...locas_Prinkipas

 

Verzik P3:

Add Verzik's final stand mechanic as she reaches 5% or lower HP. 

 

Is this in OSRS?:

Yes, these mechanics are in OSRS.

 

Has this suggestion been accepted already?:

No, we left several mechanics out of the ToB Revamp proposed a few years ago.

 

How would this benefit Alora?:

End-game raids should be engaging, enjoyable, and rewarding. After the recent buffs to unique and kit rates, Hard Mode ToB finally feels rewarding, but the raid itself is still lackluster in difficulty compared to Regular Mode. There are relatively few mechanical differences between the bosses in each raid, so the slight variation in raid times comes from the differences in boss HP. In good teams, there's hardly any difference between raid times, so you might as well do Hard Mode for the chance at ornament kits, dust, and a better pet rate. These changes would help breathe some life into Normal Mode ToB but also make Hard Mode actually feel like a more difficult version of the raid with unique differences to Normal Mode.

 

 

Alora Record Times:

 

OSRS Record Times:

 

[RealBob]

I dont support it just because if omi eventually starts buffing the bosses and raids then TOB will not be on top of that list.

If cox and zulrah and other stuff gets buffed and reworked then we can circle back to TOB, as of right now it makes no sense to make tob harder whilst cox is literally beaten down to semi afk raid.

[Variant]

no thanks, if you want to sweat go play osrs. these arent even essentially hard, its just making us spend more supplies healing to drag out the raid for what? considering hardly anyone already does tob, making it longer to stroke your own ego is a no thanks 

[real praxi]

no support. the content is just hard enough to make it enjoyable without making it completely unnaproachable to the average player. we arent all 0.1% top players who sleep through all content in the game. if you find it too easy, go play osrs where its hard.

[Tamber]

While some of these adjustments seem okay, I more-so disagree with the overall mentality that we should be raising the difficulty on content and matching it exactly to OSRS just because people have mastered it. If someone wants to run HMT with the same mechanics as OSRS, then go play OSRS kekw...This is a private server, where HMT was probably intentionally coded to be watered down, as it should be.

 

• Maiden (increased damage after consecutive hits) - if I'm reading this correctly, you just have to swap tank every 2 hits. This mechanic would be more annoying than difficult.  No support
• Maiden (increased attack speed & dmg cap) - given how low Maiden's accuracy is, I don't think this will do all that much. If anything, her accuracy could be buffed in hmt Neutral
• Nylo (prinkipas) - I think this would be a very interesting addition. So this would mean there's 4 types of nylos that spawn pre-boss? I like that...Leaning towards Support
• Verzik P3 (30% heal at 5% hp left) - similar to the first suggestion, this seems more annoying than difficult. No support

[Moron]

Support Maiden & Nylo changes but kinda neutral with Verzik P3 change.

 

Hard mode needs some changes to make it harder or atleast different since atm it is basically the same raid with regular mode. Not like every room needs changes but wouldn't mind having some different mechanics compared to regular. 

[Radagon]

No support from me. At the end of the day, alora is a private server. It should be a little easier, have higher drop rates, and much of the content should be more easily accessible to the playerbase. If I wanted it to be exactly like os, I’d just go play os.

[A]

Prolonging and increasing the difficulty for a raid that is already hard to find groups for, not really a big fan. Not to mention that OSRS has multiple different servers, which means most players have access to lower-ping worlds. Alora has a lot of players that aren't based in the U.S and have to play on very high ping. I think content difficulty is good where it's at. No support from me. 

[Scorn]

No support sorry. I normally support any idea that wants us to be as close to the main game as possible but for this one I'm against for now. To quote your suggestion, "Currently, Hard Mode isn't much more difficult than Normal Mode and can be completed nearly as quickly in good teams so there's little reason to do Normal Mode." Apart from a few good players I don't think we have that large of a playerbase to cater for the elite 1% that are already at an advantage with how badly most of the players suffer with ping. 

[Mack]

I dont support it just because if omi eventually starts buffing the bosses and raids then TOB will not be on top of that list.

If cox and zulrah and other stuff gets buffed and reworked then we can circle back to TOB, as of right now it makes no sense to make tob harder whilst cox is literally beaten down to semi afk raid.

Definitely agree that there are other pieces of content that are in need of a rework far more than ToB but I don't think that should prevent fixes from being added to roadmap. Ultimately, Omicron decides on the priority of updates and if he can squeeze in smaller tweaks to content that don't consume as much development time in sooner than full revamps I don't think that's a bad thing.

 

 

no thanks, if you want to sweat go play osrs. these arent even essentially hard, its just making us spend more supplies healing to drag out the raid for what? considering hardly anyone already does tob, making it longer to stroke your own ego is a no thanks 

Rather contradictory to say you don't want to sweat but also claim that these changes aren't making the content any harder in back to back sentences, but I digress.  I'd agree that it's not adding a substantial amount of difficulty to the raid, more so a few extra mechanics that separate it from Normal Mode and add a bit of depth. Extending Verzik's enrage phase in Phase 3 certainly adds a bit of difficulty as its a more dangerous portion of the raid and most teams kill Verzik during webs without ever having to deal with half of her specials in P3 so this change would likely require teams to engage with those mechanics. Frankly not sure what updating content to be more in line with OSRS but still watered down for a RSPS has to do with ego but that's likely just a bit of projection. 

 

 

no support. the content is just hard enough to make it enjoyable without making it completely unapproachable to the average player. we aren't all 0.1% top players who sleep through all content in the game. if you find it too easy, go play osrs where its hard.

I disagree that these small changes would make Hard Mode unapproachable to regular players. And again these only apply to Hard Mode so the average player can still gain familiarity with the raid in Regular Mode and then learn a few more differences in the raid when doing Hard Mode. Both versions of the raid are miles from OSRS difficulty, and I'm not pushing to make the content 1:1.

 

 

 

While some of these adjustments seem okay, I more-so disagree with the overall mentality that we should be raising the difficulty on content and matching it exactly to OSRS just because people have mastered it. If someone wants to run HMT with the same mechanics as OSRS, then go play OSRS kekw...This is a private server, where HMT was probably intentionally coded to be watered down, as it should be.

 

• Maiden (increased damage after consecutive hits) - if I'm reading this correctly, you just have to swap tank every 2 hits. This mechanic would be more annoying than difficult.  No support
• Maiden (increased attack speed & dmg cap) - given how low Maiden's accuracy is, I don't think this will do all that much. If anything, her accuracy could be buffed in hmt Neutral
• Nylo (prinkipas) - I think this would be a very interesting addition. So this would mean there's 4 types of nylos that spawn pre-boss? I like that...Leaning towards Support
• Verzik P3 (30% heal at 5% hp left) - similar to the first suggestion, this seems more annoying than difficult. No support

 

Again, these changes do not bring HMT remotely close to OSRS difficulty. Dozens of mechanics are still left out which is fine for RSPS. The changes I've proposed would just give some distinction between the Normal and Hard Mode encounters in areas that currently are no different between the modes. Other rooms already contain distinctions like hands falling the entire time at Bloat, multiple players doing the maze at Sotetseg, two large balls at Sotetseg instead of one, etc.

 

• Maiden (increased damage after consecutive hits) - if I'm reading this correctly, you just have to swap tank every 2 hits. This mechanic would be more annoying than difficult.  No support
  • ​Agree that this isn't a super difficult mechanic, but it adds some depth to the room moving to cycle tanks as opposed to standing still shooting a tbow at the boss for 1-2 minutes for anyone that isn't freezing nylocas.
• Maiden (increased attack speed & dmg cap) - given how low Maiden's accuracy is, I don't think this will do all that much. If anything, her accuracy could be buffed in hmt Neutral
  • Fair point, Maiden is super inaccurate but this change would just make it more important to freeze nylocas properly. ​If Maiden is attacking up to twice as fast and has a higher max hit you're more likely to take more damage, especially when compacted with the double damage from 3+ consecutive hits. 
• Nylo (prinkipas) - I think this would be a very interesting addition. So this would mean there's 4 types of nylos that spawn pre-boss? I like that...Leaning towards Support
  • ​Yes, the Nylo princes are essentially demi-bosses that spawn on those static waves prior to the boss. Their HP scales based on team size so it just adds 
• Verzik P3 (30% heal at 5% hp left) - similar to the first suggestion, this seems more annoying than difficult. No support
  • ​I addressed this one in an earlier comment, I'd argue it definitely adds some difficulty as enrage Verzik with tornadoes active is a more challenging part of the raid and would likely lead to teams having to deal with yellows and the green ball which are normally skipped due to how fast Verzik is killed.

 

No support from me. At the end of the day, alora is a private server. It should be a little easier, have higher drop rates, and much of the content should be more easily accessible to the playerbase. If I wanted it to be exactly like os, I’d just go play os.

I'll echo what I've said above. These changes do not remotely bring the content inline with OSRS difficulty, the raid would still be significantly easier and leave out several mechanics in each room. These changes would just add a slight bit of difficulty and uniqueness to differentiate it from Normal Mode. 

[Ball Up Top]

No support, if you want exact OSRS mechanics you should go and play OSRS.

Group end game content is already difficult enough to get into for new players, and even harder to find good teams for once you are into it. I genuinely don't understand how someone who opposed making solo/duo tob harder while the majority of the community supported it doesn't understand that the community doesn't want a harder ToB.

I'm nowhere near as active as I once was but somehow I'm still more active than you - but I have no interest in making game changes for a game I barely play anymore I don't get why you do just to go inactive for another 9 months. I also find it incredibly problematic that the same person who attempted to monetize difficult content into a services discord is now asking for more content to be made more difficult, it makes me wonder what your intentions are here because the community doesn't want it so it's not for them who is it for?

[Lets Funk]

No support from me. I once asked for a revamp of cox and it only made things worse. Sometimes I just think it's fine as it currently is. If you need a challenge you can always try it on osrs.

[Variant]

@Mack you ask for these shit updates that nobody wants and then dissapear for months at a time while, we're left with a worse game because of it. If any of us wanted to play osrs we would, we're not looking for that in a rsps (clearly from the mass no support replys). 

 

Also my comment was not contradictory at all, if you don't nit pick at what I said out of context. I stand by what I said, if you want harder content, go play OSRS, YOU said making these changes would make harder mode tob "harder" but you seem to be confusing hard content with just a longer fight for most of these suggestions.

 

Sycthe isnt the most expensive mega rare because people enjoy doing tob, but your solution is to make it even more gate kept? I'm wondering if all of this is just another attempt at making your boosting discord more profitable

[Capless]

No support
imo alora tob should be nerfed down after seeing the time records being only 1 minute faster than Osrs is criminal
should be much faster/easier on a fake osrs

idk what you guys trying to achieve by asking to make this raid harder as its something that not supposed to be solo'd

[Mack]

No support, if you want exact OSRS mechanics you should go and play OSRS.

Group end game content is already difficult enough to get into for new players, and even harder to find good teams for once you are into it. I genuinely don't understand how someone who opposed making solo/duo tob harder while the majority of the community supported it doesn't understand that the community doesn't want a harder ToB.

I'm nowhere near as active as I once was but somehow I'm still more active than you - but I have no interest in making game changes for a game I barely play anymore I don't get why you do just to go inactive for another 9 months. I also find it incredibly problematic that the same person who attempted to monetize difficult content into a services discord is now asking for more content to be made more difficult, it makes me wonder what your intentions are here because the community doesn't want it so it's not for them who is it for?

I'll echo this again for you, I know there's a lot of tough reading above. I'm not suggesting to resemble OSRS 1:1. I've suggested four tweaks to the current raid to better differentiate it from Normal Mode. If you are remotely aware of how the raid functions between OSRS and Alora this will be easily identifiable.

 

Ultimately, if the community doesn't want the update then it won't get added, that's how suggestions work. I can't force content into the game and I'm not here to argue or attack people personally when it has no relevance. My replies to comments are simply a discussion where I'm trying to provide some additional context to the initial post. If people's opinions remain unchanged that's their prerogative.  Understandably, people are opposed to change, but there was also a lot of push back after the first ToB Revamp and now the vast majority of the player base that took the time to learn the new mechanics enjoy the raid much more than before. 

 

I'm not sure what my playtime has to do with the suggestion, but I have been actively playing Alora again for the last 2-3 months and plan to continue doing so. I appreciate you keeping such a close eye on me, I'd be worried about me too after killing 10k Kreearra and Graardor. 

[JUlCE]

Bro why you trying to kill an already dead raid? you know yourself how many people actively do that raid...

 HMT even in osrs is a very small community of people that actually do clean completions and it's been out for years.

[93]

TOB already suffers with a severe lack of players. The general player base of Alora can barely do Normal Mode, so why are we making HM that much harder for them? The usual parties at TOB will not accept anyone that isn't using a scythe already, or won't let you join if you aren't in their clan/usual group. For the players learning, this is actually going to be difficult for them. For the players who DO know how to do TOB, this is just a mere annoyance. 
If we're suggesting making TOB harder, we should be looking at adding Jad/Zuk healers, making Olm running 1:1 with osrs and other stuff that makes content harder. 
 

[Sagacious]

Agreeing with @Moron here. I would like to see a few different mechanics to HMT so there is more of a difference between the modes. For example the Nylocas one seems fun and Maiden change would make it less afk. Support overall.

[Radagon]

I'll echo what I've said above. These changes do not remotely bring the content inline with OSRS difficulty, the raid would still be significantly easier and leave out several mechanics in each room. These changes would just add a slight bit of difficulty and uniqueness to differentiate it from Normal Mode. 

 

While I personally don't support your suggestion (own my volition, despite all the other "no supports"), I can definitely see where you're coming from. It's hard to thread the line between posing a challenge for experienced players but also not being off putting to newer players

[Mhk]

Support Maiden & Nylo changes but kinda neutral with Verzik P3 change.

 

Hard mode needs some changes to make it harder or atleast different since atm it is basically the same raid with regular mode. Not like every room needs changes but wouldn't mind having some different mechanics compared to regular. 

I'd lean most towards what Moron said, you can pretty much faceroll a HM TOB at the moment without much thought or much additional mechanics from normal mode.

It's also weird trying to explain the differences to someone that has done HM TOB on OSRS, it would help us be closer mechanic wise while not making the raid much more difficult.

Hard mode barely has a better DR & mainly just provides a cosmetic kit, I don't see it being a game breaking addition to add these in support.